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Anonymous 0x16c
said (9mo ago #1305 ✔️ ✔️ 91% ✖️ ✖️ ), referenced by >>1706:

Guide to Carroll Quigley’s books

Carroll Quigley was a historian who lived from 1910 to 1977. He is a major influence on a bunch of people in our little circle, myself included. Mr. Quigley’s great genius is in analyzing how political and economic systems are intertwined, a subject where too many others get moralistic or prescriptive rather than analytical. He is worldly yet remains idealistic, and is theoretical yet remains grounded and concrete, both of which I’ve tried to emulate in my own work. Mr. Quigley is a theory autist who puts in a great deal of effort to work with precisely-defined terms that are as simple as possible, and no simpler.

This post describes his major works. Free online copies are available at http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htm.

The Evolution of Civilizations

I’ve read a lot of civilizational rise-and-fall theories, and this one seems like the best by far. I’ve read it three or four times. In this theory, the expansion and eventual corruption of the civilization’s economic system drives its development, and is upstream of its political and spiritual health.

First Mr. Quigley talks about his method of theorizing and how to think about history. Then he spends several chapters laying out concepts and defining the terms he’ll use throughout the book, eventually building up to giving the best definition that I’ve yet encountered of what “a civilization” is. Only then is he ready to describe the seven stages that civilizations go through between birth and collapse. From there, he spends the last half of the book walking through historical examples, describing how various civilizations have developed in terms of his theory, eventually ending with our own Western civilization.

For those of you who enjoy video, Mr. Lerangis summarizes the theory at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lwTbZWUBqw.

Weapons Systems and Political Stability

This book argues for a theory where political systems are downstream of a society’s dominant weapons system. To oversimplify: when the best weapons system is cheap and usable by skilled amateurs (e.g. muskets), this leads to citizen armies and democracy, whereas when weapons systems are expensive and require specialists (e.g. heavy cavalry), this leads to mercenary armies and authoritarianism. When the dominant weapons system favors offense, this produces large states, and when the dominant weapons system favors defense, this produces small states. The concept of a “weapons system”, as a combination of physical and social technologies, is a useful one that has stuck with me.

The theory in this one is relatively brief. The bulk consists of Mr. Quigley using this lens to describe all of recorded military history. He got as far as the Middle Ages before he died.

Tragedy and Hope: A History of the World in Our Time

This is Mr. Quigley’s telling the world’s history throughout the 20th century, up to its publication in the mid 60s. Eclectic, wide-ranging, and extremely insightful. I got the most value out of its accounts of World War statesmanship and diplomacy, and his descriptions of the political activity of financiers. This book really drives home how the course of history can turn on the particular decisions of individuals, not just your Alexanders and Napoleons, but also relatively ordinary men who happen to be in charge at a critical moment.

Watch out: There’s been some censored and “abridged” publications of this book, which remove sections, or edit bits to say the opposite of Mr. Quigley’s text. I don’t know what’s up with that. In any case, you want the more recent edition that says “UNABRIDGED” in small print at the top.

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Carroll Quigley was (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ 91% ✖️ ✖️

Anonymous 0x16c
said (9mo ago #1306 ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️ ):

The Anglo-American Establishment

This book is a history of the Milner Group, an elite political conspiracy within the late British empire’s civil service. Mr. Quigley knew many of the members personally. It’s an informative case study of how real conspiracies operate in the modern world, remarkable mainly for how bland it is, and for how easy it is for external live players to manipulate the group and turn it to their own ends, especially once the Milner Group’s key strategists are gone. The book is tedious at times, as much of it consists of recounting the careers and accomplishments of bureaucrats whose lives and careers are all variants of the same theme.

Despite the name, here Mr. Quigley describes only the Anglo side of the conspiracy. He mentions the American elements only briefly; he expands on them more deeply in Tragedy and Hope.

The Anglo-American E (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️

Anonymous 0x184
said (9mo ago #1337 ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️ ), referenced by >>1362:

Great reviews anon. I know a bunch of you have been quite influenced by Quigley but I haven't managed to read as much of it as I'd like. We should pick one of the best and do a book club, perhaps.

Great reviews anon. (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️

Anonymous 0x16c
said (9mo ago #1362 ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️ ), referenced by >>1377:

>>1337
Maybe I'll run a series of threads to read and discuss Tragedy and Hope, or Weapons Systems, depending on interest and on my schedule. Both are big, dense tomes, but rewarding. Who here would be committed enough to do the reading? Anyone have a preference between the two? Feel free to glance at the books (http://www.carrollquigley.net/books.htm) before you answer.

(Normally I'd suggest Evolution as the entry point, but I don't feel super excited about reading it again so soon. If someone else runs it then I'll participate.)

Maybe I'll run a ser (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️

Anonymous 0x19c
said (9mo ago #1373 ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️ ):

I've enjoyed The Evolution of Civilizations quite a bit, after participating in a book club you hosted. I'd love to read another Quigley book with you.

But both Tragedy and Hope, or Weapons Systems seem quite a commitment looking at the page counts and lately I'm a little busy. Do you think one needs to read all of it, or is the book amenable to skipping certain sections and focusing on others. I can commit to ~150 pages a week of reading. Tragedy and Hope seem the more interesting option to me.

I've enjoyed The Evo (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️

Anonymous 0x1a0
said (9mo ago #1377 ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️ ):

>>1362

I just bought, but have not yet started, Tragedy and Hope, so that one would have my vote.

I just bought, but h (hidden) ✔️ ✔️ --- ✖️ ✖️

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